tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8383701632927065467.post8102211959295419454..comments2023-08-21T03:51:17.425-06:00Comments on Enlightened Catholicism: USCCB On The Debt Ceiling Crisis: A Return To A More Traditional Political Stancecolkochhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03432916690101599393noreply@blogger.comBlogger11125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8383701632927065467.post-82608154670745129942011-08-09T14:09:58.990-06:002011-08-09T14:09:58.990-06:00I agree with the need for an independent group/mov...I agree with the need for an independent group/movement that advocates for the poor, the overworked, the neglected. It's too bad that mainline Christianity often doesn't seem to eager to fully step into that role. I suppose it needs an external movement to guide it as well.Peaceful Turmoilhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09781659991013149078noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8383701632927065467.post-85514691118387242392011-07-28T19:59:29.567-06:002011-07-28T19:59:29.567-06:00Dennis I'm not quite sure what to make of Amer...Dennis I'm not quite sure what to make of American Elect. Seems to have a large financial sector influence. I can't help but think certain members of that group helped fund the Tea Party and that has evolved to bite them in the ass. It was a monster they created and now can't control.<br /><br />The sudden influx of cash for American Elect might indicate another attempt to influence voters, but this time in a more centrist direction, which still means nothing good for most Americans.<br /><br />Butterfly, you are on target. Both parties seem to have abrogated their core constituents. The Republicans have sold out to scared right wing single issue zealots of some sort, and Democrats to right center business interests. In the meantime the middle class is quickly become educated trailer trash. How sweet it is.colkochhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03432916690101599393noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8383701632927065467.post-45183617754409784872011-07-28T10:57:15.214-06:002011-07-28T10:57:15.214-06:00My concern is that the problems with our political...My concern is that the problems with our political and economic systems are irreparable, and we lack the will to fix them.khughes1963https://www.blogger.com/profile/16118365554189078448noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8383701632927065467.post-72705440793474428882011-07-28T10:37:23.860-06:002011-07-28T10:37:23.860-06:00I have no experience of Nixon, but IMO Obama has b...I have no experience of Nixon, but IMO Obama has been very Clintonian in governing,(that is not a compliment) heck his staff is full of Clinton alumni.<br /><br />KallistiAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8383701632927065467.post-34910890181990493872011-07-28T10:14:07.951-06:002011-07-28T10:14:07.951-06:00If you want to understand how far right the U.S. h...If you want to understand how far right the U.S. has moved, rent and see the film, "Born Yesterday" starring the great Judy Holliday.<br /><br />There are dialogue lines in it that will have your head shaking in disbelief. How could Hollywood have had the temerity?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8383701632927065467.post-39506155593947487012011-07-28T09:18:08.268-06:002011-07-28T09:18:08.268-06:00The above was posted by Butterfly.The above was posted by Butterfly.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8383701632927065467.post-9778040408813756002011-07-28T09:13:08.355-06:002011-07-28T09:13:08.355-06:00I'm sure if I surveyed Catholic Trad blogs, I&...I'm sure if I surveyed Catholic Trad blogs, I'll see them championing a "humble submission of the mind and will" to the Bishops' statement.<br /><br />"No!" you say?<br /><br />Why not? If the bishops had reiterated their teachings on women's ordination, same-sex marriage, and ANYTHING to do with the pelvis, they would be screaming at us to do it!kevin57https://www.blogger.com/profile/01681985465980196347noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8383701632927065467.post-32453865754524393182011-07-28T09:09:37.297-06:002011-07-28T09:09:37.297-06:00Butterfly, here is an article from this mornings L...Butterfly, here is an article from this mornings LA Times about many who want other options in candidates:<br /><br />http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-americans-elect-20110728,0,116246.story<br /><br />Will another group get the clout of Ross Perot and influence the results of the next election. Mayor Blumberg seemed to want to run last time, could a third party both win and govern. Obama even when he had the clout of the congress still had let the republican agenda weaken his biggest success reforming medical care. The current congress has vowed not to pay for this reform even though it might well save money in the long run. <br /><br />Ralph Nader and Ross Perot had their influence. There was good and bad in each's attempt, but neither were successful in changing the steady corruption of the American system.rdp46https://www.blogger.com/profile/04427786268228285222noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8383701632927065467.post-63337431508174620432011-07-28T09:04:02.917-06:002011-07-28T09:04:02.917-06:00Whether the Constitution is set up that way or not...Whether the Constitution is set up that way or not I believe is irrelevant in extreme circumstances. Obama does not seem to be a Democrat anymore, so another party would really be a real Democratic Party. So the 3rd Party would not really be a 3rd Party, it would be a committed political force with the agenda that is Democratic.<br /><br />I also agree with Clinton that Obama should use the power of the 14th amendment and raise the debt celling. That makes perfect sense to me. I also agree with you that the Republicans don't give a hoot about the economy, jobs creation, the American people, nor do they care about anybody except for their bank accounts, that must be cushioned or something from some economic collapse that they would benefit from.<br /><br />The violence visual is clearly seen when one understands that people who have no hope, no job, no dream, will start acting crazy. With nothing to lose different factions will congregate and cause mayhem. They will be suppressed by the powers in place already and they will not hesitate to use force.<br /><br />Everyday I read news accounts of law enforcement overstepping their boundaries. People who live in ghettos have lived with that for years. The jails are filled with poor people. The rich steal and the poor pay the price.<br /><br />I don't know what is going to happen either. There are many level headed and clear thinking persons that need to unify their small groups in order to help straighten out a rotten situation. The alternative to a third party is a movement that puts pressure on the President and the Congress to act in the interests of the People.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8383701632927065467.post-26969957341128934412011-07-28T06:07:53.910-06:002011-07-28T06:07:53.910-06:00Butterfly, I am not certain that the way we are se...Butterfly, I am not certain that the way we are set up constitutionally really allows for any third party to flourish. Otherwise, I pretty much agree with much you are saying. I think that we really have a problem as we elected Obama to govern as a Democrat and to espouse traditional democratic issues and he has let far right republicans frame the agenda and has been pushed to govern as a president of the right. It is interesting because the Republicans want him out at any cost even to bankrupt this country. Right now the people see Obama as the more reasonable one but will they when the elections come next year if the economy has crashed? I just don't know what is ahead but I do agree with Clinton that Obama should use the power of the 14th amendment and raise the debt celling. President Obama does not seem to have the intestinal fortitude to do it. Clinton would have and Bush would have in a minute. <br /><br />Finally, the Catholic Bishops speak out in a positive way but they have lost all their creditability. They have helped put into office these politicians and the Bishops can not control them. Only billionaires can. The Bishops real agenda is to remain in the good graces of the Billionaires. This is the same church thinking that caused a flirtation with the Nazis in the thirties. <br /><br />We seem to be headed for more street demonstrations and possibly violence in the streets. Will the US military shoot at the public. The Soviet military and Egyptian military refused, but what will happen here. I have felt for some time that the misguided Catholic Bishops are leading us toward a violent world.<br /><br />One thing for certain the politicians our bishops supported are threatening an internal revolution against two institutions that most Americans really cherish--- social security and medicare. What will happen to those tea baggers who no longer get their ss checks or to the availability of medical care if medicare defaults? What will happen to all of us if social security is "privatized" and medicare is put in the hands of insurance companies. This is the "adult conversation" that the Republicans propose. I have felt for some time that the politicians that our Bishops support will lead us to violence in the streets. This is a world that I hate to leave to my children and grand children. When my father died in the nineties, he was hopeful for our world, the circumstances for hope are much more dim right now.rdp46https://www.blogger.com/profile/04427786268228285222noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8383701632927065467.post-38470549852658051672011-07-28T00:56:26.459-06:002011-07-28T00:56:26.459-06:00The US Congress has not been listening to the citi...The US Congress has not been listening to the citizens of this country for forty years or more. They've been listening to the bankers, the lobbyist for big business like oil and gas. Both parties seem to have a center in which people can agree on basic issues. It is usually the spin-doctors and talking heads on TV News programs that still believe we're living in a world of a two party system. The two party system is broken and has been for years. It's been dysfunctional in the sense that both parties have not been working for the people's interest.<br /><br />We definitely need a third party progressive movement that speaks about the issues of creating a nation we can all live in and thrive in. <br /><br />* Education - A college education should be FREE. This nation is becoming dumb and only getting dumber, in comparison to other countries test scores.<br /><br />* Health Care - We all need it and it should not cost a fortune to get quality care. Med students should not have to pay for their education. One of the reasons for the high cost is the high cost of their education, which they pass on to their patients.<br /><br />* No Interest Mortgages <br /><br />Forward March America into a brighter future. Time to enter a new age. People are sick and tired of politicians who say one thing and then do another!!! Let's rid ourselves of this nightmare of US political campaigns as usual in which the only people who "win" are the wealthy.<br /><br />Let me put it this way: if we don't start a third party this country is going into a black hole in the universe and all hell could break loose. People are really fed up and disgusted in the politics as usual.<br /><br />ButterflyAnonymousnoreply@blogger.com