tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8383701632927065467.post5158742941158878168..comments2023-08-21T03:51:17.425-06:00Comments on Enlightened Catholicism: AB Chaput Talks A Catholic Version Of Spiritual Warfare At US Air Force Academycolkochhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03432916690101599393noreply@blogger.comBlogger8125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8383701632927065467.post-91832351418745242192010-10-28T20:48:09.065-06:002010-10-28T20:48:09.065-06:00p2p, what you say makes sense. I thought this quot...p2p, what you say makes sense. I thought this quote was interesting too and can interpret it as Chaput talking about himself and his type of leadership via projection.<br /><br />"And yet I think it's true -- I know it's true -- that my generation has, in some ways, been among the most foolish in American history. We've been absorbed in our appetites, naïve about the consequences of our actions, overconfident in our power, and unwilling to submit ourselves to the obligations that come with the greatest ideals of our own heritage..."<br /><br />It sure does sound like Chaput is talking about himself being absorbed in his own appetite for power.butterflyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09684946870144030594noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8383701632927065467.post-75648825726635981442010-10-28T18:56:50.275-06:002010-10-28T18:56:50.275-06:00A lot of good comments, but I need to address mjc&...A lot of good comments, but I need to address mjc's mention of Chaput's famous call to consider how the unborn will call us to account when we die. If the unborn call anyone to account, which I seriously doubt, it will be those who did nothing to help their mothers make a different decision or support the birth of their children. Chaput will be only one bishop in a long line of bishops who would have to answer for this. <br /><br />I would personally love to see the emphasis switch from condemnation to contemplation about how to create a world in which bringing children into it is not a fear filled decision, but a great joy. That world won't be created by military crusaders or B2 bomber pilots who answer to a higher command. That mentality can only maintain the existing mess of a status quo.<br /><br />Creating 'on earth as it is in heaven' comes through love, passion, joy, hope, and empathy which Jesus told us were all attributes of his Father's will. It's much too easy to reduce obedience to the will of the Father to acts of behavior when in point of fact that Will is about mental and emotional attitudes.colkochhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03432916690101599393noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8383701632927065467.post-62369150822758331662010-10-28T16:11:06.085-06:002010-10-28T16:11:06.085-06:00The reference to the crusades and crusaders also s...The reference to the crusades and crusaders also shows an astounding lack of understanding of history. At the time of the crusades they Caliphate looked positively educated, enlightened, tolerant and just, compared to the rest of Europe. <br /><br />The great library of Cordoba, one of many in the city, contained more than a quarter million volumes. That single library had more books than all the rest of Christian Europe combined.<br /><br />Here's an account from Archibald Wilberforce writing in 1898: The Caliphate of Cordova in "Spain and Her Colonies"<br /><br />http://www.shsu.edu/~his_ncp/Cordoba.html <br /><br /><b><i>"Nor was it only material splendor that was to be found at Cordova. At a time when Christian Europe was steeped in ignorance and barbarism, in superstition and prejudice, every branch of science was studied under the favor and protection of the Ommeyad Caliphs. Medicine, surgery, botany, chemistry, poetry, the arts, philosophy, literature, all flourished at the court and city of Cordova. Agriculture was cultivated with a perfection, both theoretical and practical, which is apparent from the works of contemporary Arab writers. The Silo, so lately introduced into England as a valuable agricultural novelty, is not only the invention of the Arabs, but the very name is Arabic, as is that of the Azequia and of the Noria of modern Spain. Both the second and the third Abdur Rahman were passionately fond of gardening and tree-p]anting; and seeds, roots and cuttings were brought from all parts of the world and acclimatized in the gardens at Cordova. A pomegranate of peculiar excellence, the Safari, which was introduced by the second Abdur Rahman from Damascus, still maintains its superiority, and is known in Spain to the present day as the Granada Zafari.<br /><br />Thus, in small things as in great, the Arabs of Cordova stood immeasurably above everv other people or any other government in Europe. Yet their influence unhappily was but small. They surpassed, but they did not lead. The very greatness of their superiority rendered their example fruitless. Medieval chivalry, indeed, was largely the result of their influence in Spain. But chivalry as an institution had itself decayed long before a new-born Europe had attained to the material and moral perfection of the great Emirs of Cordova...<br /><br />(After the crusades) <br /><br />"Cordova was sacked. The Caliph was imprisoned; rebellions, poisonings, crucifixions, civil war, bigotry and skepticism, the insolence of wealth, the insolence of power, a Mahdi and a Wahdi, Christian alliance, Berber domination, Slav mutineers5 African interference, puppet princes, all these things vexed the Spanish BIoslems for thirty disastrous years; while a number of weak but independent sovereignties arose on the ruins of the great Caliphate of the West.<br /><br />The confused annals of the last thirty years of the rule of the Ommeyades are mere records of blood and of shame, a pitiful story of departed greatness..."</i></b><br /><br />We should not be proud of the crusades. I say this as descendant of a man whose forces defeated 5 Muslim armies. <br /><br />p2p<br /><br />(For those keeping score at home I'm Irish on my mother's side of the family.)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8383701632927065467.post-63430132445710058642010-10-28T16:08:38.270-06:002010-10-28T16:08:38.270-06:00As an outsider let me say that Chaput's appare...As an outsider let me say that Chaput's apparent promotion of military exceptionalism is contrary to the Catholic faith. <br /><br />In 2009 the USA was responsible for 46.5% of the world's military spending. <br /><br />http://www.globalissues.org/article/75/world-military-spending <br /><br />I read this quote somewhat differently <b><i>"And yet I think it's true -- I know it's true -- that my generation has, in some ways, been among the most foolish in American history. We've been absorbed in our appetites, naïve about the consequences of our actions, overconfident in our power, and unwilling to submit ourselves to the obligations that come with the greatest ideals of our own heritage..."</i></b> I understand him to be referring to the George W. Bush & Dick Cheney leadership. <br /><br />To reference the crusades in the context of two immoral wars (so says JP2) continuing in Islamic states is the height of irresponsibility. <br /><br />p2p<br /><br />word verification: corse, Italian for racesAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8383701632927065467.post-23727273613717143962010-10-28T15:11:26.157-06:002010-10-28T15:11:26.157-06:00I take offense when anyone denigrates the religion...I take offense when anyone denigrates the religion of another and goes out on aggressive conversion campaigns because "our way is the only way." But in this case, I'm really disgusted because of the obvious crackpottery of NAR in whole, someone either has to be very psychologically damaged or just plain evil to want to be part of it in the first place. They're another brainwashing cult that wants to dominate not just their followers but everyone else as well.<br /><br />I also really resent these more bombastic, loony xian fringe theologies invading and distorting the contemplative, meaningful, searching Catholicism I was raised with. If authority wants to preach NAR let them abdicate their current positions. <br /><br />I bet the MRFF is already fighting this as we speak. <br /><br />KallistiAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8383701632927065467.post-20841465682499476162010-10-28T12:02:08.814-06:002010-10-28T12:02:08.814-06:00Colleen, fascinating stuff you've been writing...Colleen, fascinating stuff you've been writing about lately. When I listen to the conservative line, there are some things you touch on here that I'm always struck by. First, the military theme is always sounded. We are warriors, we're in a war, we face a treacherous and cunning enemy, many are duped but we must not be , etc. Does anyone who knows the early Church Fathers know of whom Chaput is speaking when he claims the trope of "Spiritual Warfare"? If so, pre-Nicene council and Constantine? I find his assertion hard to believe.<br /><br />Second, Chaput himself is always touted as "brilliant". I have to say, I've looked for it and I don't get it. My pastor quoted Chaput the other day, to the effect that we will have to answer the aborted souls in heaven as to what we did or didn't do to save them. And I thought, "As if they didn't know. They know us better than we know ourselves. They won't come accusing, they'll come in sympathy (or I guess in sympathetic misery as I'm marched to hell)." <br /> I've looked at this talk and the diatribe about the secular media a few weeks ago. Does anybody see this guy as brilliant, the way Benedict can be?<br /><br />It seems most of all that I keep feeling I'm being sold something. The focus is on a type of tunnel vision, sold as courageous focus but definitely a shutting out of contrary thought. As you note, it is based on fear and not fear-of-the-Lord, two very separate entities. And I keep seeing the "everybody's doing it" line, even when I see most around me pulling away from what they see as a lack of Christianity from our leaders. Still watching, still praying, still trying to marry action and contemplation.mjcnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8383701632927065467.post-577937489871780072010-10-28T10:12:33.851-06:002010-10-28T10:12:33.851-06:00"In the philosophy and theology of the NAR co..."In the philosophy and theology of the NAR contains a pronounced eschatalogical bent which is centered on Armageddon occurring in Israel between the Israeli State and the Islamic hordes. The NAR truly desires to bring on Armageddon in order to usher in the Second Coming."<br /><br />This is a totally unacceptable psychotic world view and AB Chaput needs to wake up!!! It is a totally unchristian view. What will it take for these delusions to dissipate, evaporate, disintegrate? I can only wish that AB Chaput would have a real encounter with Jesus, and also with some spaceships and extraterrestrials.... that might wake him up!! <br /><br />"The fear of God is the beginning of wisdom" is a quote that charismatics use to "prove" if one has "real faith." It is such a shallow misunderstanding of Faith. <br /><br />My stomach churns over AB Chaput's militaristic view of Jesus of which he shares with NAR. It is heresy to be in alliance with folks that are working for armageddon. It will not bring Jesus Christ, a second coming - but it will bring death and destruction and a new world order of oppression dictated by idiots with no wisdom from God. He projects his own mediocrity of Faith, treasonous beliefs, closed mindedness and blindness throughout his talk at the US Air Force Academy.<br /><br />AB Chaput is a heretic and a treasonous hate-filled ignorant man. He is a dangerous person to have in any kind of position of power in the Church or in the world.butterflyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09684946870144030594noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8383701632927065467.post-32547303608560633302010-10-28T09:37:45.887-06:002010-10-28T09:37:45.887-06:00I retired from SDANG earlier this year. And I'...I retired from SDANG earlier this year. And I've been associated with the military in various ways for most of my life, as a dependent child, as a dependent spouse and as a member.<br /><br />Most of the professional military training I had - coming from the military mind you - stressed the absolute need for developing one's spirituality in becoming an effective military member. But never at any point did I feel they were directing the specific path to take in gaining that development. Not even the chaplains would direct a specific path.<br /><br />So I'm not sure how to take the various news reports that I've heard over the years and in particular the reports that have come out since roughly the time Bush 2 took office. Those reports just never seemed to correlate to the direct experience I've had. Maybe I've just been lucky. Or maybe there is a breakdown of sorts that hadn't shown up yet in the units where I've held assignments.<br /><br />What I will say is that with our volunteer force, and within large parameters, the military more or less reflects the larger population in the country. Yes, there are certain groups over represented and others that are under represented or even not at all - at least officially. But the attitudes are I think widely represented. The attitudes, biases and prejudices are going to be largely reflective of the population at large. So if you have a larger non-military population with certain Church Militant attitudes, you should not be surprised to find some of those same attitudes displayed by military members. The ideal of reflecting the whole population is part of the military doctrine in the US.<br />VeronicaAnonymousnoreply@blogger.com